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MrCulé

Sunwell Nightbane 2.4.3 - Summary & Poll!

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Naud    0
23 hours ago, Lithit said:

I was actually looking forward to trying the server, but dual spec in the store is too close to p2w for me, so I am probably gonna pass if that is actually a thing, and I am sure a lot of others feel the same. 

 

I'm feeling the same. Usually when having one single spec & when being low on gold & when wishing to do both PvE and PvP, people would most likely use the mixed spec (not a true PvP, not a true PvE spec). This leads to having much less advantage in either PvE and PvP. And making some sort of VIP dual specs is too nasty, cuz it somewhat gives quite some advantage in reality. Also in PvP alliance has quite alright racials, I even can't decide which race hunter I'd want to make in there. And overall it would turn the balance to alliance side in terms of PvP, at least for the battlegrounds and lower arena rates.

I'd even prefer to rolling alliance if it'd make you not implement this system. I wanted to go Horde though just cuz i want a retri pala (have played as him back in the days) and that they have Seal of Blood (tho that one ability still gives preference to the PvE retribution imo due to giving more mana from heals). And having just one BE paladin (i don't really like their looks+animations much) and other alliance chars is quite hard due to the unavailability of transferring gold between those two factions (not considering neutral AH as I don't wish to pay the additional taxes for using those).

I want to point out the fact that it won't really change everything and if changes, in some aspects it's too much of a p2w.

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OakyHefty    0

Dual spec for alliance is acceptable. If there are less alliance it will surely allow people to take multiple roles in game.

 

BUT i disagree with 

 

Quote

 

Furthermore, the Alliance will get two additional bonuses.

  • the costs of mounts will be lower. The skill of ground mounts - 50% lower, the skill of flying mounts 15% lower(mounts won't be discounted).
  • The alliance will get additionally 4 weekends when they will be able to take advantage of the experience boost events. The exp. multiplier for them will be x2 up to 70 lvl(but only during these weekends, normally it is x1 from 56 lvl). Additional weekends will be organized from December to April(but will be organized when RF race is done - the first one in mid December).


 

The reasons are simple, this will give alliance TOO big advantage in first weeks of server. Skill for mounts are the most expensive parts of mount cost, and so alliance will have alot faster access to mounts (Especially 100% ground mounts because price reduction is like 300g), what can bring small inbalance in world PVP. 

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MrCulé    201
2 hours ago, Naud said:

I want to point out the fact that it won't really change everything and if changes, in some aspects it's too much of a p2w.

How can you win using dual spec? HOW? I don't ask if this is the advantage, time saver or other thing. I'm asking about P2W. How can you beat other players using dual spec? 

When I read such statements I don't know what's better choice to do: cry or laugh. Look at the current MMO standards and think a bit about it; all MMO games should be currently considered as P2W. 

P2W in WoW concerning only, ONLY selling items that increase your damage, healing, toughness etc. Even gold buying isn't P2W thing, you can say it's unfair, but it's not pay to win aspect. 

Dual spec can be bought both with real money and gold. If you don't want to support the project, just don't do it. But most of people don't care about testing, don't care that we need money to mantain the project, don't care actually about everything, but come here and write unwise and subjective definitions what is what. Moreover they require 24/7 support, great scripting, superb stability and interesting ads.

Try to notice the big picture of the whole situation, because we must do it every day. 

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Popopidopop    0

Since this is the only thread, I will have to ask my question here:

How are the vanilla raids? They scripted well enough to be farmable?

Many classes have BIS items in AQ and Naxx like Trinkets from Viscidus and Sapphiron and these bosses would need to be available to farm these items.

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MrCulé    201
14 minutes ago, Popopidopop said:

Since this is the only thread, I will have to ask my question here:

How are the vanilla raids? They scripted well enough to be farmable?

Many classes have BIS items in AQ and Naxx like Trinkets from Viscidus and Sapphiron and these bosses would need to be available to farm these items.

To be honest with you, Vanilla raid will be rewritten after the launch. Currently we've rewritten Vanila dungeons and we foucs on TBC content. However Vanilla raids are an important plan of future works. 

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MrCulé    201
25 minutes ago, eriath said:

At what level dual spec will be available? Like could I buy it for my alts before release of BT.

Good question, I'll ask my collegues from the team and let you know. Thank you for this question 👍

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Naud    0
1 hour ago, MrCulé said:

How can you win using dual spec? HOW? I don't ask if this is the advantage, time saver or other thing. I'm asking about P2W. How can you beat other players using dual spec? 

Try to notice the big picture of the whole situation, because we must do it every day. 

I think you can understand also from the whole situation that there's always a bigger picture that we can't rly grasp whole. I wrote about an option in where it would be considered as p2w from my PoV (that post of mine which you quoted).

I offered another way in the Summary topic - make some quests for a daily auto-complete option. It is close, saves gold, higher rep etc etc, but it's somewhat of lesser advantage so-to-say, and feels to me as really just a time-saving feature. You lose many quests due to x2 rates anyway so why care when you can just auto-complete like 3-5 more per day. It's quite a few but it might be enough to bring you donations just cuz it's convenient. I support the server by playing on it and making the community bigger and trying to be nice to others.

The option to always being able to switch spec while others can't... I sadly don't remember how much gold you can easily farm up in TBC but there's already many ways of spending it (profs, mounts, all the enchants, gems etc). And if there's always some one-way where you can auto-reset talents but it costs somewhat a lot and still greed doesn't allow you to reset it all the time casually (and you won't get enough gold for that i think, so will stick to the PvP-PvE mix-spec), then it's not all that great. It makes the person somewhat need to farm for it to have a base option to balance with others. PvP spec does differ from PvE.

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Aledati    6

There will be dual spec and deal with it, if you do not like it do not join server and gtfo. There was poll for voting and ppl mostly voted for it. If they didnt put dual spec then even more ppl would cry about it so shut up.

I wish there will be option to buy some gold from server. Better pay on server and keep it alive than from private hackers via some pages. If you do not put buying gold on page there will be tons of bots farming and selling gold for money. And buying gold is not that much p2w in wow anyway. I would buy 5k gold for fast flying for example rater than farm it for months. 

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MrCulé    201
2 hours ago, Aledati said:

There will be dual spec and deal with it, if you do not like it do not join server and gtfo. There was poll for voting and ppl mostly voted for it. If they didnt put dual spec then even more ppl would cry about it so shut up.

I wish there will be option to buy some gold from server. Better pay on server and keep it alive than from private hackers via some pages. If you do not put buying gold on page there will be tons of bots farming and selling gold for money. And buying gold is not that much p2w in wow anyway. I would buy 5k gold for fast flying for example rater than farm it for months. 

Yeah, we know. People will always buy gold, it's quite clear; but as far as community is against it, we'll have to ban players who buy gold ilegally. 

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MrCulé    201

Good morning, 

I'd like to sum up the yesterday's devs meeting as well as make an update regarding TBC information. 

- TBC "dual spec" will be available from 60 lvl(if we decide to implement this tool, which is highly likely due to poll results). 
- .blizzlike command will be obviously available. ".blizzlike" will change your multiplier on the blizzlike one. 
- We're still thinking of enabling Dynamic Respawn in first days after a launch, however this respawn would be only related to quests and quest items. 

Furthermore, we're really satisfied because of BETA tests. Everything goes well so far and we'll be definitely ready on 30th November. Nex week we're going to finish The Eye and then Afgann, Riztazz and Dootz will focus on the open world, locations and a complete clean of the bugtracker. 

Anakin will be working on the classes until 30th November. We really care about the proper working of talents as well as skills because we're aware that many players are waiting for quality PvP experience. 

Luukasm will finish the movement system and then will rewrite mob fanning. Both of these things should be done within next 2 weeks. After these two weeks he will be working only on the optimalization of server performence. 

Siof as the security developer will do his best to secure the auth server and prepare the realm for potential attakcs. 

Moreover, @Graal will also do his best to copy the open world of TBC as it was back then:

STOCK: 

1052361363_ImagePastedat2018-11-712-25.thumb.png.012acc87dc8dc5490f3c5bafdc492313.png

Sunwell TBC: 

2.thumb.jpg.f1cef0609f18ecdb42ef11b3fcbf38ef.jpg

STOCK:

3.thumb.jpg.4944747ec51d77061c60fd31a5ec8f13.jpg

Sunwell TBC: 

4.thumb.jpg.57ddd1454b967bf4da9b1be609a75e50.jpg

If you are involved in tests, please check class talents and skills this week and report everything you will find on Bugtracker. You can also make research concerning bugs, cheats, explotis etc.

Thank you in advance.

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Naud    0
23 hours ago, Aledati said:

There will be dual spec and deal with it, if you do not like it do not join server and gtfo. There was poll for voting and ppl mostly voted for it. If they didnt put dual spec then even more ppl would cry about it so shut up.

I already stated the point that it doesn't seem interesting enough for me to be playing if there's pretty much any traces of p2w content. Thus I still doubt i'd play in there as of now, while the criterias are still being modified (though not playing on WOTLK already due to loss of interest, just somewhat curious as to how it'll turn out with the TBC server release).

21 hours ago, MrCulé said:

Yeah, we know. People will always buy gold, it's quite clear; but as far as community is against it, we'll have to ban players who buy gold ilegally. 

imagine a guy who has never-ever spent cash onto online games or have never used cheats at online games. Unbelievable, right? :D  But well, developers do need cash, so i guess it's not that important to deal with the needs of an exception.

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neheri    28
33 minutes ago, Naud said:

it doesn't seem interesting enough for me

You also stated that you wanted to add 3-5 autocompleted daily quests for the alliance. Apparently this server is just not for you.

Administration will not be able to appease everyone, but definitely much more people would leave if your "ideas" were implemented. 

If you like fun servers, give Warmane a chance.

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Aledati    6
38 minutes ago, Naud said:

Imagine a guy who has never-ever spent cash onto online games or have never used cheats at online games. Unbelievable, right? :D  

Imagine yourself developing game for 3 years and keeping game alive for few years more and server is full players like you. Unbelievable, right?

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Naud    0
5 hours ago, neheri said:

You also stated that you wanted to add 3-5 autocompleted daily quests for the alliance. Apparently this server is just not for you.

Administration will not be able to appease everyone, but definitely much more people would leave if your "ideas" were implemented. 

If you like fun servers, give Warmane a chance.

1. Think more. 2. It won't make it a fun server, why not consider x2 rate, x3 events etc as a fun server? Why all those discounts to keep balance between Ally-Horde? I offer just an option to auto-complete just cuz it covers by some point pretty much everything - mount issue (travelling to another area to just give the quest), bit higher exp rate from the quests which you don't want to do but still want the rewards/gold/items, more gold, option to do dailies in any spec, and just a convenience for those who don't have enough time for dailies to get at least some reputation. 3. I'm not against the dual-spec at all, i wouldn't even mind implementing more stuff from different addons, but only if it's on equal base for everyone. The issue of all that i have said before was: p2w. Or how come you didn't catch that?.. Or just trolling?

5 hours ago, Aledati said:

Imagine yourself developing game for 3 years and keeping game alive for few years more and server is full players like you. Unbelievable, right?

True, I wouldn't go for that, at least now, but the issue was that he said "People will always buy gold..". You also didn't seem to catch the idea.

Though maybe it's me who isn't able to really get it to everyone's minds by my usage of words. Or you see something which makes you angry, dunno.

Edited by Naud

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neheri    28
6 hours ago, Naud said:

The issue of all that i have said before was: p2w.

Please tell me how can dual spec give you advantage over other players on arenas, BGs, in 5mans or 25mans. I really can't see that. It will also be available for gold so it is also farm2win (if you're not able to farm 500g or 2000g then this server is not for you). Paying 100 SC does not give you any real advantage. 

I am personally supporting x1 XP rates, especially because I spent a lot of time on beta server and can see that almost everything works (bugs are vanishing from github pretty fast so I believe that it will brilliant on the release date) and even x2 XP means that you will skip a lot of quest/zones/content. Leveling is an important part of this game, get over it. It may not be in BfA and if you prefer that - feel free to go play on BfA. 

Things like dual talents/cheaper mounts are acceptable only under condition that this with huge probablity will solve one of the most important issue of TBC servers - faction imbalance.

Freaky things like x5 XP or autocompleted quest will just make this a fun server nobody wants.

And to be honest - a guy that everything wants for free - you are a first person to leave in case of even smallest sign of crisis. If you don't put time and effort on some goal you won't care about it and will just leave at first opportunity. If server was based on people like you it would be doomed from the very beginning. 

 

  • Bravo! 3

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Vosha    0
8 hours ago, neheri said:

I am personally supporting x1 XP rates, especially because I spent a lot of time on beta server and can see that almost everything works (bugs are vanishing from github pretty fast so I believe that it will brilliant on the release date) and even x2 XP means that you will skip a lot of quest/zones/content. Leveling is an important part of this game, get over it. It may not be in BfA and if you prefer that - feel free to go play on BfA.

That's Vanilla content though. We are here for TBC, not Vanilla. Leveling is slow enough as it is. 2x rates pretty much mean we will skip some grinding rather than some entire zones.

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neheri    28
1 hour ago, Vosha said:

We are here for TBC, not Vanilla. Leveling is slow enough as it is. 2x rates pretty much mean we will skip some grinding rather than some entire zones.

Back into day when you joined retail TBC there was no "we're here for TBC, let's skip vanilla" and unless you played vanilla as well you had to go all the way through from 1 to 70 with x1 rates. To be clear x2 is acceptable, I'd just personally prefer x1 but if majority prefers x2 that's perfectly fine.

And x2 is indeed skipping zones and content. I am playing on beta (it has the same XP rules as the release will have as far as I reckon) and I skpped: 100% silverpine forest, 100% desolace, 100% badlands, 100% Swamp of Sorrows, now I am lvl 50 and I haven't set my foot yet in tanaris, hinterlands, felwood, ungoro, WP, EPL, Silithus, Winterspring... not to mention that I had to skip dungeon quests (unfortunately not able to find party for 5 mans). So yes, leveling is damn fast. 

 

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Naud    0
12 hours ago, neheri said:

Please tell me how can dual spec give you advantage over other players on arenas, BGs, in 5mans or 25mans. I really can't see that. It will also be available for gold so it is also farm2win (if you're not able to farm 500g or 2000g then this server is not for you). Paying 100 SC does not give you any real advantage. 

I am personally supporting x1 XP rates, especially because I spent a lot of time on beta server and can see that almost everything works (bugs are vanishing from github pretty fast so I believe that it will brilliant on the release date) and even x2 XP means that you will skip a lot of quest/zones/content. Leveling is an important part of this game, get over it. It may not be in BfA and if you prefer that - feel free to go play on BfA. 

Things like dual talents/cheaper mounts are acceptable only under condition that this with huge probablity will solve one of the most important issue of TBC servers - faction imbalance.

Freaky things like x5 XP or autocompleted quest will just make this a fun server nobody wants.

And to be honest - a guy that everything wants for free - you are a first person to leave in case of even smallest sign of crisis. If you don't put time and effort on some goal you won't care about it and will just leave at first opportunity. If server was based on people like you it would be doomed from the very beginning. 

 

I've played WoW for far too long and i think it made it's impact on how i see this stuff. I've seen p2w servers, almost haven't played on fun-servers, mostly played on x1-x3 ones. I think you might get the idea that i don't like "fun"-servers from this. You're too quick to judge.

About how it is p2w, check my previous answers, or i just dunno what else to say. Maybe you see it differently. But let's say, you have lots of ways of spending gold already that requires you to do so so that you'd be on par with maybe not the..."hardcore" players, but just simple semi-hardcore raiders or even casual ones. And if "all you need is to just farm"... well let's say you have "just farm" for 3 months in same area so that you see some result. Would you fall for that? There was one situation not long ago about "just need to spend XXX time" in Star Wars game which led to a pretty huge uproar, when someone had counted all that up. Or just spend some cash and get an advantage of that same level. As far as i remember, TBC had lower prices overall comparing to Wotlk and even Wotlk has 1k gold requirement for the dual-spec. So don't you think that 2k in TBC (and not counting the thing that PvP or PvE spec have more benefit for their situations than the mixed spec, which many horde chars would have, so that will make the situation bad in PvP bgs at the very least, considering that alliance has alright racials for PvP).

Autocompleted quests are just 3-5 in amount per day. How many do you do personally when you levelup? Or how many do you do at max level as dailies and do you rly like doing them over and over again? So i think it's a nice option to have more alliance players instead of a somewhat too beneficial dualspec for them.

Rly, i'm pretty bored saying all the same again and again..

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Thraxexus    1

Hello,

First of all thanks for coming out with a new TBC server I know a lot of people have been anticipating a decent one from talk on Vanilla private servers and with official Legacy server coming out from Blizzard again. I see this is a somewhat adjusted server compared to Blizzard's exact approach to their release/development of TBC which is okay because they didn't do it perfect. As a vertan WoW player from Vanilla playing through all expansions and frequenting private servers your ideas are pretty good. Although the biggest complaint is restricting Horde's ability to dual spec until BT. Honestly the racials on both sides are balanced Alliances (human) racial favors PvP and always will (Every Man For Himself) and Horde's for PvE. To some people like myself and many others PvP is the biggest aspect of the game making Alliance human the big ticket. So you're going to reward me and hinder the horde from the get go by going ahead with this. It could be argued and easily more justified to allow both to dual spec from the start and cost the same. Let's say you don't agree with this though and think Horde still has the advantage (which they don't in PvP), then simply require the horde to pay more for respec (which you already are) but don't make them wait a whole freaking year or more to get dual spec at x4 price as well. Personally I would only make them pay twice as much to get dual spec not x4 and be available as soon as it is to Alliance, but that's obviously up to you guys. Everything else seems pretty good to me though. Might I also suggest allowing orcs to be red please? ❤️ It fits the TBC theme perfectly and I would gladly pay for something like that. No pay to win is always the way to go and allowing someone to switch spec at a whim with no cost after purchasing once on an already PvP superior faction is just a terrible idea. Also PLEASE PLEASE do something about the daily quests, I don't have the exact solution but repeating the exact same quests every day doing the exact same things to grind out a reputation or what have you is terrible that's literally like going to work and doing something you dislike just to get your paycheck living day to day. Albert Einstein is broadly credited with exclaiming “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results”. Except the sad part here is we know the exact result and it's pure boredom but we do nothing about it when there is solutions. I have a ton of ideas that wouldn't change game mechanics, class builds or the core fundamentals to the game if you're interest just PM me or whatever. Just learned about you guys and excited for this project. Thanks for reading this if you do admin.

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neheri    28
2 hours ago, Thraxexus said:

Alliances (human) racial favors PvP and always will (Every Man For Himself)

> That came in WotLK. In TBC Alliance has mace spec, sword spec, extra stealth detect (perception) and 10% spirit (it's that the best racial for priests in the game btw?).

but don't make them wait a whole freaking year or more to get dual spec at x4 price as well

> Just play the alliance. That's the idea.

Also PLEASE PLEASE do something about the daily quests, I don't have the exact solution but repeating the exact same quests every day doing the exact same things to grind out a reputation

> You don't have to do any daily quests. To get rep for heroics you can grind normals. Heroics will let you get gear with which you can start doing kara, maybe GL/ML if you find a guild. Daily quests are optional until SSO (SWP patch) so unless you want to farm a mount or some gold you can just forget about them. 

 

 

Edited by neheri

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Thraxexus    1
26 minutes ago, neheri said:

> That came in WotLK. In TBC Alliance has mace spec, sword spec, extra stealth detect (perception) and 10% spirit (it's that the best racial for healing priests and druids btw?).

Oh could of swore they added it in TBC, must be blurring expansions in my head. Also yes that is the best racial for those healers as far as my knowledge goes, so they do have a PvE advantage still, also sword spec warrior is huge with fury and mace spec Stormbringer spec is also huge. I really don't see how they think think racials are so imbalanced to handicap the Horde as much as they are :/ I'm generally an Alliance player too but hate having to play on servers with an unhealthy faction balance.

26 minutes ago, neheri said:

> Just play the alliance. That's the idea.

That's how you kill the server in less than a month though :( I don't want to see that happen here but I guarantee you the PvP will be super weak because there will be no horde and less people means less donations.

26 minutes ago, neheri said:

> You don't have to do any daily quests. To get rep for heroics you can grind normals. Heroics will let you get gear with which you can start doing kara, maybe GL/ML if you find a guild. Daily quests are optional until SSO (SWP patch) so unless you want to farm a mount or some gold you can just forget about them. 

Good point, also they will have a system for buying gold from them if I feel I don't have the time because of work but need gold and want to donate. As long as it's reasonable obviously.

Edited by Thraxexus

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neheri    28
14 minutes ago, Thraxexus said:

That's how you kill the server in less than a month though :( I don't want to see that happen here but I guarantee you the PvP will be super weak because there will be no horde and less people means less donations.

Dual spec for the alliance only means a lot more allies, hopefully it will be roughly 50:50. If administration achieves that other aspects of the server will be great as well so there's no way it will die quickly. 

Trust me I would love dual spec for hordes as well because I am planning to play prot warrior and would love to make stunherald and do PvP, however if not having dual spec is the price of a balanced server I take it. If you won't be able to farm for dual spec, choice for you should be simple - roll an ally.

If you played vanilla you should be used to farming which is much easier in TBC than it was back into days in vanilla. There will be simply not that much farming (not much things to spend gold on too) and administration already announced that they will ban gold sellers and there will be no cash shop which would be obvious pay2win which is great, no gold selling means no inflation, I've seen AH prices on paymane and this was just ridiculous. Same flask there was approximately 20 x more expensive than I've seen it on other TBC servers.

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Thraxexus    1
12 minutes ago, neheri said:

Dual spec for the alliance only means a lot more allies, hopefully it will be roughly 50:50. If administration achieves that other aspects of the server will be great as well so there's no way it will die quickly. 

I really think it will do the opposite sadly I see no way it wouldn't to be honest the racials aren't so imbalanced to justify such an action thus everyone will be Alliance thus killing the server.

 

14 minutes ago, neheri said:

If you played vanilla you should be used to farming which is much easier in TBC than it was back into days in vanilla

Very true, although I thought they already said you can buy Sunwell coins which convert to gold?

  • LOL 1

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neheri    28
24 minutes ago, Thraxexus said:

Very true, although I thought they already said you can buy Sunwell coins which convert to gold?

Could you please tell me where they said that? I don't believe they did. It would be just pure pay2win and that's the first thing everybody wants to avoid. 

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